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Thread: Daz Studio Pro/Advanced vs Poser 9/Pro 2012: Initial Comparisons

  1. #1

    Daz Studio Pro/Advanced vs Poser 9/Pro 2012: Initial Comparisons

    Okay, I haven't broken down the full list of features to compare, but let's look at the stuff I know that I can compare.

    First off, Daz is only selling it to Platinum Club Members and at reduced pricing, which in itself is a pretty cheap way to get folks to join that, and a poor substitute for Smith Micro's Pre-order pricing.

    So, Here's the breakdown of prices (pre-order price in parenthesis):
    D|S Advanced: Upgrade $109.95 ($65.42) Full: $229.95 ($136.82)
    D|S Pro: Upgrade $334.95 ($187.57) Full: $429.95 ($240.77)

    Poser 9: Upgrade $129.99 ($79.99) Full: $239.99 ($149.99)
    Poser Pro 2012: Upgrade $199.99 ($149.99) Full: $499.99 ($249.99)

    As we can see, the prices are almost exactly in line, almost like DAZ copied Smith Micro's Pricing and then dropped it a little to make themselves look more attractive. The big difference is the Poser Pro Upgrade pricing, which just blows the D|A Pro upgrade pricing out of the water. Other then that, all those non .99 digits are just there to confuse us and make it look great, it's a marketing tactic I am familiar with, being in retail.

    Then there's another difference, one Daz has done it's best to hide. What is that? Hidden by default, in the description of D|S 4 description is one line that will make certain users rage.

    NOTE: DAZ Studio 4 Advanced is not stable on Mac OSX Lion.

    Would love to see a technical breakdown of the differences by one of our Ambassadors.
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  2. #2
    Well, I actually like both programs and I use both, DS for the technical side (content development) and Poser for all the creative stuff. Both have their merits.

    For me, the main differences are these:

    DAZ concentrated on creating a software that fulfills the requirements of their own figure. Smith Micro created a software that offers more of everything for the users.

    All that is new in DS4 is that now you can use the new DAZ content. The rendering is a bit faster but still slow compared to Poser. The DS surface tab doesn't bring anything new. Renders done in DS4 won't look much different than they did in DS3.

    Poser however does give us the new weight mapping features (and it looks to me that Poser's tools are more versatile than DS's), but it doesn't stop there. We get improvements to lighting (new features for IDL-emitting objects), we get improvements to the materials (just take a look at the demo threads). It also comes with a new Python version which is beyond my grasp but I suspect it offers more possibilities to the script creators than the old version. Added to that are several improvements of existing features.

    I've just searched the DAZ homepage for a feature list of the upcoming DS4 Pro and couldn't find anything. So we can only guess whether a toolset for creating our own content (like the setup tools for DS3) will be included in DS4 pro or whether it will be an extra package.
    Anyway, with Poser Pro 2012 you get all the tools you need to create your own content. That's also a big plus.

    As I said, I've been using both programs for quite a while. Time will show whether I can go on doing that or whether I'll focus on one or the other. At the moment I'm quite decidedly leaning towards Poser
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  3. #3
    Oh, the toolkit is also for sale.

    Content Creator Toolkit: Upgrade $99.95 ($59.47) Full $199.95 ($118.97)

    As with the Adv/Pro, it is still Platinum Club Only, which may account for why it is not showing up. I also noticed that some of the features of D|S are NOT being released with the initial release. That means they obviously rushed production of it, probably to get it out before Poser.

    And for those wondering how I got this info if it can't be searched, I am in the Platinum Club, and I have a feeling the "Instant Alert" email I got about an hour ago was just for PC members.
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  4. #4
    And DS4A\Pro does not have a manual with the launch of the program.

    All the best.

    LROG

    Antonia Polygon - Standard Now available at RDNA & BluEcho's site
    Antonia Polygon - WM Now available at RDNA

  5. #5
    I was the same as Esha, though skewed much more towards Poser. I used Poser Pro 2010 for most things and DS3 Advanced with the toolkit for its rigging features (though only in a very basic manner) and ERC dial building.

    However, there are a couple of *IFs* now.

    If I were to use any Poser weight mapping features, then there's no reason at all for me to enter DAZ Studio, even to use the ERC dial features. I'm pretty confident that even if DS could import the cr2, all the mapping would be destroyed, so then I'd still need to get the ERC back to the original somehow.

    If someone uses Poser's dependent parameters, again there's no reason to enter DAZ Studio, even for the creation features because its very likely it's going to destroy the dependent parameter system on import and it certainly is not going to export it back to a cr2.

    I think a lot of features, like dependent parameters (and to some degree Shaders, cloth, PMD and other things native to Poser) were ignored because folks, rightly so, tried to keep it backwards compatible and compatible with DAZ Studio.

    Now we are in a phase where we need to kind of question that. Do we continue to stick with stuff that (for the most part) goes back to Poser 4 in terms of technology, simply to allow compatibility? Or do we move ahead and see what we can do with Poser? Right now if I touch weight mapping or dependent parameters, I can forget using DS. Even if it were all to get emulated via some means it's going to take a while to mature.

    For me, it's beyond what I like and goes instead to which I want to embrace because of it's feature set. I don't dislike DS *except* that I feel stuck using Poser 4 technology. I'm not fond of trying to stick everything into bloody MAT Poses either but that's probably another story for another time

    Hey and there's always simple props. Those can be used in just about any program, from DAZ to Poser to Carrara to a modeler (except for effort to re-adjust textures). So we still have those in common.
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    "What 'thing'?" - River Song
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  6. #6

  7. #7
    Where is the manual for DS4A mattymanx?

    Also, where is the manual for the CCT???? Wasn't that supposed to have been written so that the PA's could use it. If it is done, it needs to be included with the package.

    It will probably appear in 2 years as a paid item.

    All the best.

    LROG

    Antonia Polygon - Standard Now available at RDNA & BluEcho's site
    Antonia Polygon - WM Now available at RDNA

  8. #8
    I was not addressing anything concerning the manual. I was adding a comparison between DS4A and Poser 9.

  9. #9
    Here's a quick list of plugins we're still working on and that are not included in the pre-release version of DAZ Studio 4:

    OptiTex Dynamic Clothing

    OptiTex Dynamic Clothing Control
    Morph Follower
    pwSurface and other pw Shaders
    Reality render-engine (sold separately)


    So, it's really incomplete at the moment, and people are paying for it????

    It's hard to do comparisons, when parts are missing.

    All the best.

    LROG

    Antonia Polygon - Standard Now available at RDNA & BluEcho's site
    Antonia Polygon - WM Now available at RDNA

  10. #10
    I was not addressing anything concerning the manual. I was adding a comparison between DS4A and Poser 9.

    Well, Poser 9 - Poser 2012 will launch with a manual, so that should be part of the comparison.

    You can't just pick and select the parts you want, It's all or nothing.All the best.

    LROG

    Antonia Polygon - Standard Now available at RDNA & BluEcho's site
    Antonia Polygon - WM Now available at RDNA

  11. #11
    Yeah, IMHO the program offerings look similar but aren't. You can't quite look at them and compare just by what they are called.

    Poser 9 (figure creation - non-weight mapped only, material room, cloth creation, hair room, face room - where it applies, can use but not create weight mapped figures, 32 bit only, wardrobe wizard included)

    Poser Pro 2012 (all that comes with P9, weight mapping creation, weight mapping transfer, 64 bit, collada, other exports, render queue, background render)

    DAZ Studio 4 regular (simple materials, can use but not design shaders, no rigging - weight map or otherwise, no cloth - hair - face tech, has mighty morphing genesis, 32 bit only)

    DAZ Studio 4 Advanced (All DS4 features, auto fit, render passes, morph loader advanced, shader mixing and building, 64 bit)

    DAZ Studio 4 Pro (All DS4A features, content creation and editing, photoshop 3D support, texture manipulation mostly designed for game engines).
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    "I'll do a 'thing'." - The Doctor
    "What 'thing'?" - River Song
    "I don't know... it's a 'thing' in progress! Respect the 'thing'." - The Doctor

    - Doctor Who, "Flesh and Stone"


  12. #12
    pwSurface and the other pwPlugins have never been sold as a part of DS but as plugins. Dan is not required to upgrade them any more then anyone else is required to upgrade their plugins.

    As for the OptiTex plugin and Morph Follower, would you prefer they include buggy plugins and deminishes the program even more? They stated why its not included. We can either except it or not.

    Realtiy is a seperate plugin. Why it was listed I do not know. Paolo has stated in the Reality threads that he will do a DS4 version. He never stated that it would ever be availble before DAZ releases DS4.

    The OP did not included info regarding the lack of a manual in DS4 or that its 64bit and the P9 will have a manual and that its not 64bit. So we both added one extra tidbit in favor of one side or the other. So we both picked the part we wanted!

    In all fairness, prices aside, until Poser 9 and PP 2012 becomes availible, no one can really compare one companies software to another.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by paganeagle View Post
    I was not addressing anything concerning the manual. I was adding a comparison between DS4A and Poser 9.

    Well, Poser 9 - Poser 2012 will launch with a manual, so that should be part of the comparison.

    You can't just pick and select the parts you want, It's all or nothing.All the best.

    LROG
    To be fair, there IS a manual in progress that one can access, but it's online only. No PDF yet.

    Also, Reality is a moot point since it was always an add-on to DS and not part of the program itself. It would be like complaining that Poser Pro 2012 is missing stuff because Advanced Render Settings has not been updated for it yet (at least not released anyway). Same goes for pwSurface and such.

    The comments regarding Dynamic Clothing are certainly true though.

  14. #14
    If you don't have ZBrush or Photoshop, what use are those expensive options in DS4A???

    All the best.

    LROg

    Antonia Polygon - Standard Now available at RDNA & BluEcho's site
    Antonia Polygon - WM Now available at RDNA

  15. #15
    To be fair, there IS a manual in progress that one can access, but it's online only. No PDF yet.

    Not another Soon thing!!! Seen too many of those over the years.

    All the best.

    LROG

    Antonia Polygon - Standard Now available at RDNA & BluEcho's site
    Antonia Polygon - WM Now available at RDNA

  16. #16
    As for the OptiTex plugin and Morph Follower, would you prefer they include buggy plugins and deminishes the program even more?

    Is that an admission that the current version is buggy? If so, then it should still be in beta and not a final release.

    All the best.

    LROG

    Antonia Polygon - Standard Now available at RDNA & BluEcho's site
    Antonia Polygon - WM Now available at RDNA

  17. #17
    You can't rig at all until you either get DS 4 Pro or get DS 4 Adv and purchase the plugin separately.
    You can't make shaders at all until you get to advanced.

    The pwShaders are cool but frankly until you get to Advanced level, you are left with them being "canned". That doesn't mean "suck". That means you are left only with how they are designed. You can add to them or change how they behave beyond the ranges presented to you.

    Reality is a bridge. Nothing wrong with that at all. However, I feel Poser's firefly can stand on it's own and produce professional results without needing a bridge. Poser also has an open-source (?) Lux bridge which started as "proof of concept" if one wants a different take on their renders.

    PaganEagle has a point with the documentation. Poser comes documented. DAZ has access to an online wiki. It's up to customers to decided if one is good and one is bad. Is the wiki a "living wiki" that is updated consistently? Yes, I'm asking. I don't know. If it is a living document and can be downloaded as well, I think that's fine. It does require extra footwork though and keeping up with the wiki.

    We can provide comparisons without fighting (that would be nice). DAZ and SM are offering different programs divided into different ways.
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    "I'll do a 'thing'." - The Doctor
    "What 'thing'?" - River Song
    "I don't know... it's a 'thing' in progress! Respect the 'thing'." - The Doctor

    - Doctor Who, "Flesh and Stone"


  18. #18
    Hi Netherworks, the difference here is that we can make those points without having to favor certain moderators so that our messages are not deleted, unlike other sites.

    Comparisons were asked for.

    It has been known for some time that P9 is not 64 bit, well it has to those that read the page. LOL.

    A manual is a VERY important thing, not something that is just thought of at the last point in beta testing.

    All the best.

    LROG

    Antonia Polygon - Standard Now available at RDNA & BluEcho's site
    Antonia Polygon - WM Now available at RDNA

  19. #19
    Wiki's are well known for not being uipdated or even constructed over on certain sites.

    The wiki's were supposed to have been overhauled at the start of the year. Nothing has changed.

    All the best.

    LROG

    Antonia Polygon - Standard Now available at RDNA & BluEcho's site
    Antonia Polygon - WM Now available at RDNA

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by paganeagle View Post
    If you don't have ZBrush or Photoshop, what use are those expensive options in DS4A???

    All the best.

    LROg
    Those options do not exist in DS4A... Those are DS4Pro features...

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