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  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by robynsveil View Post
    I'm of the impression that we already have a fairly large range of figures that we could be working with. What I would love to see - and would probably be the target for all sorts of potentially lethal legal landmines - is an exercise/group class/workshop (never sure what to call this sort of thing) where a popular (or not so popular anymore) figure is re-rigged. Yes,: re-rigged! and then weight-mapped, subsequently. For example: Stephanie 3. Wouldn't Daz have a field-day with that one! So yeah, I can see potential problems with it, but my goodness, wouldn't be awesome to actually learn to rig a 3D figure so it behaves the way *you* want!!

    I would *so* be in that!
    I don't see any legal problems with a workshop like that as long as everybody participating had their own legal copy of S3 to begin with. Now sharing your results ( besides in just a picture of course ) is another matter.
    "There is no secret ingredient "
    -- Kung Fu Panda


    "Reach for the sky!"

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by yrt View Post
    I understand, and agree. I just keep reminding people of the true priorities (Which are to have a set of up-to-date figures around which all Poser users can federate their efforts. Everything else is nice, but it won't make sure we're still here in August 2012 - at least not all of us, not enough to make it worth SM's while to pay people to work on Poser.).

    (Fighting for my hide, one could say (besides the fact I don't work for SM); The fact is I like my adversaries to think of "cornered rat", rather than "corned beef"... -evil smirk- )
    Well, that's been established. And then some. I don't much see a need for a new character set to get all excited over: I personally think (in these economically difficult times) that it's not a bad idea for those who can't afford a bunch of new stuff to have a look at what they already have and use the newer technologies to breathe new life and excitement into this. I realise that that won't do much to drive the existing vendor offerings, but hey, don't you think it's time for a bit of a change, there, too? Do we not have enough NVIATWAS costumes and props? Is that all we are ever able to focus on: more of the same? We've got a whole new technology to look at and play with: if we try to think outside of the box and come up with new ways to take advantage of it, vendors will follow suit... and we'll look at a completely new, perhaps more enlightened approach to our form of art.

    Hate to think our survival is based on federation around a figure. (thinking outside the box)

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by batronyx View Post
    Now sharing your results ( besides in just a picture of course ) is another matter.
    Well, sharing INJs or some such has been working for years. We just have to find how to do it without having DAZ raining cease and desist messages over our parade.

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by robynsveil View Post
    Well, that's been established.
    So we agree on that.


    Quote Originally Posted by robynsveil View Post
    don't you think it's time for a bit of a change, there, too? Do we not have enough NVIATWAS costumes and props?
    Ooow, we surely do agree on that too!... But it doesn't remove the underlying constraints: If Poserdom is to survive commercially (that means outside of your and my runtime), we need norms. It's not me, it's a general fad. Why do people (in Real Life) ask for norms, common units and all that? Because they profit to people making stuff, and in Poserdom, people who make stuff attract people who can't make any, which are the majority...
    In short, we need to have a locomotive figure replacing DAZ figures (which means, a figure having the same level of support!), else Poser will curl up and die, no matter how good it is.


    Quote Originally Posted by robynsveil View Post
    Hate to think our survival is based on federation around a figure. (thinking outside the box)
    I understand you, I do hate it too, but that's life. It's like saying our survival is tied to petrol. A sad thing our ancestors would laugh at, but still, at this point we don't have any alternative solution... So let's just bow down and try to keep the chariot rolling.

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by robynsveil View Post
    I'm of the impression that we already have a fairly large range of figures that we could be working with. What I would love to see - and would probably be the target for all sorts of potentially lethal legal landmines - is an exercise/group class/workshop (never sure what to call this sort of thing) where a popular (or not so popular anymore) figure is re-rigged. Yes,: re-rigged! and then weight-mapped, subsequently. For example: Stephanie 3. Wouldn't Daz have a field-day with that one! So yeah, I can see potential problems with it, but my goodness, wouldn't be awesome to actually learn to rig a 3D figure so it behaves the way *you* want!!

    I would *so* be in that!
    Why would DAZ have problems with that? If your using a figure for a workshop of sorts. To show how to re-rig a figure and as long as you are not passing out that figure. In other words you must own said figure. I can't see any reason for DAZ to get upset. How many of us have already written tutorials using DAZ figures. I know I have and even DAZ has incouraged it.

    But the best way would be to use a figure already supplied with poser. Like the P2 or 3 figures P4 Possette would be a good one to learn on. I like the idea of a rigging workshop. Let me know when it happens. I'm in.

  6. #86
    "Why would DAZ have problems with that?"

    I'm just naturally cautious/paranoid. The rigging had been done by some person at daz and would messing with that involve some sort of copyright infringement? Or, pushing that boundary some: supposing we find that if we'd add an edge-loop or two of mesh, suddenly this figure would suddenly move and deform much more naturally. Now I'm really pushing the envelope, aren't I?

    ETA: Oh, and heck, I'd be in that too! What an incredible workshop would *that* be! We could play it safe and go with MakeHuman or whatever... guess there's no limits as to what you do to that bird, hey?
    Last edited by robynsveil; 08-26-2011 at 09:20 PM.

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by robynsveil View Post
    "Why would DAZ have problems with that?"

    I'm just naturally cautious/paranoid. The rigging had been done by some person at daz and would messing with that involve some sort of copyright infringement? Or, pushing that boundary some: supposing we find that if we'd add an edge-loop or two of mesh, suddenly this figure would suddenly move and deform much more naturally. Now I'm really pushing the envelope, aren't I?

    ETA: Oh, and heck, I'd be in that too! What an incredible workshop would *that* be! We could play it safe and go with MakeHuman or whatever... guess there's no limits as to what you do to that bird, hey?
    Actually you are thinking behind. Many of us have already been doing that for years. LOL.

    As long as you are not Passing out anything. Just showing how to do something. Everyone can get a free modeler to add an edge loop to thier legal copy of the mesh. Poser users have been tweeking JP's on DAZ/Zygote figures for as long as I've been around. It's what we do. Or at least it was until the click and render trend became the forefront of the DS/Poser communities.

    Agree that a figure that anyone can get thier hands on easily would be best.

  8. #88
    I hope if and when you decide on this class you announce it in other forums, there might be others that would like to join in on this rigging class. I am not looking to become an expert but I do have a curiosity about some of it. But I do stop at the point of shorting out my circuits for a hobby.

    Click and render, digging deeper, learning all, learning nothing, everyone is different in their individual use and priorities of this software. I hope everyone enjoys what they are doing because besides needing more money and security (at least here in the us) we all need a lot more enjoyment in this life.

    Me? I am going to try to make a pair of pants for Brad, when phantom3d graciously releases him. I will see if I can get the pants to move with him naturally. :-) Cool!

  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by lilwolff View Post
    I hope if and when you decide on this class you announce it in other forums, there might be others that would like to join in on this rigging class. I am not looking to become an expert but I do have a curiosity about some of it. But I do stop at the point of shorting out my circuits for a hobby.

    Click and render, digging deeper, learning all, learning nothing, everyone is different in their individual use and priorities of this software. I hope everyone enjoys what they are doing because besides needing more money and security (at least here in the us) we all need a lot more enjoyment in this life.

    Me? I am going to try to make a pair of pants for Brad, when phantom3d graciously releases him. I will see if I can get the pants to move with him naturally. :-) Cool!
    I hope too. We would like to share our own knowledge in rigging and maybe learn new stuff too.
    "Death cannot stop true love; all it can do is delay it for a little while." The Princess Bride


    "I thought you want to be an engineer when you are older.-Why you choose now Astrophysik?"-
    "because engineer have to learn so much mathematik"! ---Zo Boyer, 7 year old

  10. #90
    Wow, Mike... I think this idea is really gonna fly, you know? I've actually downloaded (going to install next) the MakeHuman software. The key point being: no posing of this figure is possible because MakeHuman doesn't rig. Blender does and Poser does, tho. This is open-source, the ideal sort of figure to learn on, because we don't have to remove any rigging already there.

    Is this an idea with merit?

    I'm currently developing dynamic mesh:


    and so that's a bit my obsession, but it can easily be transfered to figure rigging. Yeah, the dress is pov - leaves a lot to be desired - but it's all a WIP. So, rigging is next!

  11. #91
    Are all the open source humans by Sixus1 already rigged? My participation is questionable depending on when you do this, just thinking of alternatives. Are you rigging a full figure?... or a clothing item for that figure?

  12. #92
    Well, I'd like to learn to do both, LilWolff, but I reckon it might make sense to sort-of get some idea of what's involved with just doing like clothing, to start with. I have no idea what I'm getting into, so it seems like a good idea to start small.

  13. #93
    Hi robynsveil, lilwolff, I am uploading a video tutorial right now, it is about an hour long and starts with the basics. It looks like it is going to take about 7 hours to upload!!! I dont know why so long. I could not put it on youtube because it is an hour long.

    The prop we will be working with is here: http://poserplace.phantom3d.net/foru...f=2&t=1&p=2#p2

    once the video is uploaded I will post a link. Its only 300 mb dont know why it takes so long to upload. Know of any faster upload sites for video that are free?

  14. #94
    Not offhand, Mike - Laurie might do, tho (if she happens in here). I'll just wait patiently... or try to wait patiently, anyway. Which figure are you using? Or does it matter?

  15. #95
    I am using a simple human shaped prop it has been grouped but not named or rigged, so it was sorta perfect for a basic tutorial. It is on the site I linked to above if you want to take a look just download and unzip, install into Poser runtime.

  16. #96
    Thank you, Mike, will do - really looking forward to this!

  17. #97
    OMG phantom3D! How wonderfully nice of you! This is sooo exciting!

    If you need I could try to throw it up on my site if you are having any trouble putting it anywhere. If your around now I hope to be on for a wee bit more but will catch you later if Irene doesn't take our electric down.

    @ladonna hope you are still with us?

    I can't find a pm for everyone?

    OT and personal: for now my participation will be limited to as I can. I just got home from major surgery, my computer time and energy level is limited and I have other yucky un-fun stuff I have to do.

    I will follow best I can and save, save, save everything for when I possibly have more energy and less brain fog.
    Last edited by lilwolff; 08-28-2011 at 01:26 AM. Reason: double wording

  18. #98
    Hope you recovery well from your surgery, LilWolff - that can really mess up a lot, being on meds and then wanting to sort things out in a new area of Poser (to us!)...

  19. #99
    Thank you robynsveil for kind well wishes. LOL my brain has always fogged even before this and without meds. This is like adding a couple of extra thick layers of pea soup on top of what was there.

    This will be a good challenge for the mental side and so kind of everyone to do. I am so excited because I clicked once with Phantom3d's teaching style.

    Which ever by you, have a great day!

  20. #100
    Sorry to hear of your troubles. Hope you will mend quickly

    Well I did get it uploaded to 4shared. The other two vidmeo and megavideo dropped it half way through (no resume)

    Will have a better video link in a few in full HD

    And the prop and materials to follow along here: http://poserplace.phantom3d.net/foru...f=2&t=1&p=2#p2

    This first few tutorials will be usable in Poser 6 through Pro 2012. When we get to the weight mapping however Poser Pro 2012 will be needed to follow along.
    Last edited by phantom3d; 08-28-2011 at 10:26 AM.

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